! This post hasn't been updated in over a year. A lot can change in a year including my opinion and the amount of naughty words I use. There's a good chance that there's something in what's written below that someone will find objectionable. That's fine, if I tried to please everybody all of the time then I'd be a Lib Dem (remember them?) and I'm certainly not one of those. The point is, I'm not the kind of person to try and alter history in case I said something in the past that someone can use against me in the future but just remember that the person I was then isn't the person I am now nor the person I'll be in a year's time.
Source: BBC News
A muslim woman has been suspended for refusing to remove her veil when teaching English.
Staff and pupils had complained that they found her hard to understand when she was wearing her veil. The school has a lot of children who speak English as a second language and they need to be able to see the teachers lips when learning the language.
The woman refused, has been suspended and has taken Kirklees council to a tribunal. The council says that even if the tribunal goes her way it won’t change its stance.
Even muslim children are complaining that the veil is a barrier to communication.
Why didn’t you quoute BBC, Stuart? 😉
Don’t know what you mean … 🙂
Although I am not wearing a veil but I can communicate well with those who wear it, and I believe that women who want to wear it should not be punished for doing what they believe, and by the way she can remove her veil in front of children but not in front of stranger male adults which should make no problem for the school.
Hope their decision is not just because she looks muslim, but it looks like it’s.
You see, this is one of the big problem with the “muslim community” in this country and elsewhere – self-imposed victimhood.
It’s nothing to do with her being a muslim or looking like a muslim, it’s because staff and pupils at the school said that they found it hard to understand her because of her veil.
She was teaching English as a second language to young asian children. To learn the language they need to see her lips moving so they can see how sounds are formed. As someone who has learnt French, German and Dutch to varying degrees I can understand perfectly where they’re coming from – all three of those language contain sounds that don’t exist in English and without seeing the speakers lips it is very difficult to learn to make those sounds.
As you said, the interpretation of Islam that demands women wear veils says that they don’t have to wear them in front of young children. You have therefore rubbished your own argument that it’s “just because she looks muslim” by pointing out that she didn’t have to wear the veil but chose to be obstructive instead and has got herself suspended in the process. She said it is cultural but the culture she refers to does not require her to wear the veil in fornt of those young children so she is lying.
check the update
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/bradford/6050392.stm
“She said she had taught in class without the veil when there were no males present.”
threr’s no NEED for adult males to attend the class, right?? so there should be no problem!!
someone is laying here and I don’t know the truth but what I do believe that a problem was created by the teacher or the school.
I can’t speak on behalf of muslims I myself do’t agree on wearing veil, but I do respect her will to do so since it’s not hurting anybody and in her case she can take it off while teaching if the school cooperate.
I strongly disagree that muslim community is (self-imposed victimhood.) not because I know(I never been outside ME) but because this is very general accusation and it can’t be true
Sorry, I don’t understand. Why is there no need for adult males to be in the room? Are you suggesting that they should refrain just because she wants to wear a veil? Maybe in a muslim country but not here.
She wasn’t hurting anybody but she was making it harder for the children to understand her and therefore putting their education at risk. Bearing in mind she was teaching kids in England to speak English – an essential skill if they are to integrate into English society – that’s pretty important don’t you think?
The woman in question was on the news today saying that they were making the veil a barrier yet she’s the one insisting on wearing a veil in front of young children even though her religion doesn’t require it.
Incidently, there were a few old muslim women on the telly a day or two ago saying that their generation had worked hard to do away with the veil and now they have young, idealistic muslim women who don’t know anything about life deciding to go back to primitive beliefs about covering themselves up. Their words, not mine.
I don’t care what the old lady thinks nor what the teacher thinks, they’re to believe in what they want, arn’t they?
And yes I am suggesting that adult male shouldn’t enter a class who has a teacher that don’t want them to enter it!! in the three countries I lived in the teacher in his/her session has a high form of respect protected by law, for example even police can’t enter the school nor a class if s/he didn’t allow them too, no one is allowed to enter the class if s/he don’t want him/her to enter.
Teaching was kind of holey message here I don’t know about England but this should be a global think I guess!
And I can’t disagree that wearing a veil in class that teachs language might cause a problem, this is logical. but still see it simple to solve problem.
btw in country I live in now there’re alot of women who wears it, Gov employees, teachers everywhere and I never ran into a problem with em, some of them prefere to close their doors when they take it off so ppl knock the door before they enter and they wear it back, simple and working.
We can discuss this forever, but lets hold until the court says its word.
I am sure that court will make it clear for everybody.
Ok, tell me more on why a male adult shouldn’t enter the classroom. Because of the woman’s religion? I’m sorry but that’s unacceptable. This isn’t a muslim country – there is only one official religion in England and that is Church of England. This single official religion is protected by law.
Teaching shoulsn’t be a holy message. Teaching should be about teaching facts, not a religion. Religion should be taught as something people believe, not as a fact because it isn’t.
Unless the judge is weak they will find that the woman is wrong. What cultural beliefs and customs we accept in England is up to the majority English. We shouldn’t be told by immigrants what we have to do to accomodate them – they should be told what to do to accomodate us. I’m happy for people to believe what they want and to have whatever customs they want as long as it is understaood that our own culture and customs come first every time. If I moved to a muslim country I wouldn’t expect to be able to buy alcohol or for my wife to walk around in a bikini – I certainly wouldn’t expect the people in that country to change their ways to accommodate my capitalist, atheist ways. This is the difference between Islam and the west.
[…] The teacher that was suspended for refusing to remove her veil when teaching English as a second language to primary school children after children and staff complained that it was hard to understand her. She also claims it is her right to wear a veil. An anonymous muslim (woman I think) commenter on my blog says that it can be solved by banning men from going to her classroom. I say no, that isn’t acceptable in our society and it is up to the woman to accomodate us, not the other way round. […]
nice one andreas, shame no-one replied, I was hoping somebody would embarass themselves trying.
I still don’t understand why you need adult mail in the room if the teacher don’t welcome him regardless of the reason why she don’t?
And by the way what I meant by “Teaching is a holy message” was not teaching religion, I meant Teaching act is kind of holy act regardless of what is being teached. that’s why we celebrate teacher day and that’s why teachers (in my country) are very respected and has a very high position in community this could be different at yours but this is not the point.
And why women should accomdate men not the other way around?? it should be two ways!!
One last thing, wonkotsane you can check a muslim country “Dubai” and see how other nationalities live there. or you can ask your folks who live there, because I saw too many British ppl in Dubai I think you might see one too and compare the freedom they’ve to what you are saying.
Can anyone explain why a Church of England school was employing a Muslim? Just a thought…